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Staffordshire University - New PGCEi available in Bangkok from October

Discussion in 'Qualifications & Courses' started by stephenmw, 1 Jun 2016.

  1. stephenmw

    stephenmw Thread Starter Member

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    Anyone interested to know more about the new Staffordshire University PGCEi to be offered in S E Asia from October? Part-time, semi-distance learning programme, with three weekend residentials in Bangkok.

    Stephen
     
  2. bahn_farang

    bahn_farang Well-Known Member

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    yes please, we would love to know
     
  3. bahn_farang

    bahn_farang Well-Known Member

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    maybe a thread merge just for this topic?
     
  4. Stamp

    Stamp Administrator Staff Member

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    Yes, please. Provide as much information as you can in this thread. The members and visitors of Thailand Teaching are highly interested.
     
  5. stephenmw

    stephenmw Thread Starter Member

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    OK. I am Staffordshire University's PGCEi Programme Coordinator (Asia) based in Chiang Mai. I can provide further info on request but these are the key points of the programme:

    1. Designed, taught, assessed and validated by Staffs Univ. educational PGCE specialists with the programme following DoE PGCE guidelines.

    2. Starts end of October with first of three Bangkok (weekend) residentials. Other two residentials end of Feb and end of May. Programme concludes end of June.

    3. Programme includes teaching practice requirement with formal assessment by Staffs Univ tutor.

    4. PGCEi credit worth is 60 credits, transferable to full MA Ed.

    5. Part-time, semi-distance learning plus the three residentials.

    6. Entry requirements: first degree or equivalent. English language. Working as a teacher in any formal educational organisation in S E Asia (entry preference being given to teachers based in Thailand).

    7. Fees given on request but discounts offered if we receive 3 or more applications from a single school.

    Based on my previous experience of designing and delivering similar programmes for Keele University, targeted at educationalists in Asia, I would anticipate that graduates of this SU PGCEi will be likely to get a Thai teaching licence, though please bear in mind that the MoE treats every application for a licence on its individual merit.

    Stephen
    ps. I have attached the Course Details.
     

    Attached Files:

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  6. Stamp

    Stamp Administrator Staff Member

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    Thanks for the info, stephenmw. :thumbs up

    4,950 GBP = 255,465.97 THB. The Nottingham PGCEi costs 180,713.46 THB. Could you explain in a nutshell the key-differences between the two? Thanks.
     
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  7. stephenmw

    stephenmw Thread Starter Member

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    Sure. There has been, up to now, two credible PGCEis currently available to expat teachers in Asia. Sunderland U PGCEi which costs £6,250 and Nottingham U PGCEi which costs £3,500. So the Staffs U is in the middle range but it is a better, credible and more comprehensive programme because 1. it includes three weekend taught residentials in BKK and 2. a guaranteed practicum assessment by a SU tutor.

    (NB:I helped design and deliver the Keele Un PGCEi which cost over £4k and was a good programme, but is now discontinued because Keele have pulled out of any Asia-based delivery since last year - the SU PGCEi is as good if not better).

    Also bear in mind that the leading int. schools are not impressed with the Nottingham PGCEi precisely because it has no taught element - its 100% online. So the Staffs PGCEi will quickly become the leading qualification of its type. If you are spending this type of money then you need to be sure that the qualification is going to be considered credible and worthy by the people who run the schools. I am also a director of an int. school in Brunei so am very experienced. Also done lots of IS consultancy around Asia so know most of the leading schools and lots of senior managers. I am confident in the SU product. And in the quality and experience of those SU specialists delivering it.

    Stephen
     
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  8. portnoy58

    portnoy58 Well-Known Member

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    This needs to be corrected. The Nottingham PGCEi requires physical attendance at a four day training event in Bangkok. It is not optional. You cannot receive the award without attendance at this event. So to say it is '100% online' is misleading.

    I do not know what leading international schools think about the Nottingham PGCEi but when I contacted Pattana in Bangkok ( about 12 months ago) about this matter they advised that this qualification would suffice. That is a fairly important endorsement IMHO. My own view is there is such an exodus of disillusioned British teachers from the UK, that most international schools can select from candidates holding UK PGCEs backed up with QTS. I therefore think it is going to be difficult for anyone with a PGCEi, regardless of what institution awards it, to get the big contract in the international sector in the current climate.

    My impression was the Nottingham PGCEi, which of course I was awarded, is well regarded. There is anecdotal evidence, of people known to regular posters here who have progressed into decent schools with this qualification, and I also heard from fellow students on my course of people who had progressed on to greater things.

    I'll let you know when I finally land that big one!
     
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  9. stephenmw

    stephenmw Thread Starter Member

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    I have different anecdotal evidence on the value and credibility of the Notts PGCEi, including from top IS schools such as Pattana. So we'll have to differ on that. What I do know and am confident of, is that while the Notts PGCEi may 'suffice' for some IS's the SU PGCEi, offering a much more intense, long-term and comprehensive teaching element, will be a stronger and more credible programme. In the end, the market (as ever) will judge. But my experience of helping deliver the Keele PGCEi (now no longer available in Asia) is that the residential elements have to be more than a single commitment and need to be offered over the duration of the programme so that students can reflect, feedback, learn and adjust. This cannot be done in four days and any educationalist knows that. The SU PGCEi will be of this standard.
     
  10. Gor Blimey Guvnur!

    Gor Blimey Guvnur! What the duck ! Staff Member

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    Fair enough Stephen but there are quite a few out there content to have the Nottingham based PGCEi and have done well also. One friend in a top tier Bangkok inter progressed to 110K plus numerous benefits on top within 5 years of completing the course offered by Nottingham and has just landed a good position in KL starting next month for the equivalent of 150k plus benefits. Not too shabby with a Nottingham PGCEi and your claims that your one is superior are indeed hard to prove.
    I suggest the best move you can make is to lower your price and sell hard ... sorry but 75k more is quite a gap. Good luck but I think you will find that many weighing it up will go to Nottingham unless you can sell your percieved benefits better and more factually.....money is money.
     
    Last edited: 1 Jun 2016
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  11. stephenmw

    stephenmw Thread Starter Member

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    OK, I understand your position. But will have to differ. The Notts PGCEi could be described as largely an Accreditation of Prior Learning, while the SU PGCEi will stretch you professionally. Which as a teacher intending to have a career in the profession, you need to experience.

    I was actively involved with senior Keele and SU managers in designing their respective PGCEis from 2011 onwards and there was never any question that we would go the Nottingham route. We had to consider not only the reputation of the university, but also the worthiness of the whole experience for the student. Western expats teaching in Asia are not only competing with fully qualified (PGCE) Western teachers but increasingly with high quality Filipino ones - who have invariably done a 4 year BEd and are really on the ball when it comes to teaching - I know, I have formally observed many across Asia. Many unqualified Western teachers in Asia may be more likely to choose the Notts PGCEi based on price. But that doesn't make it better programme or, crucially, better for their future careers. SU won't change their stance on this, not a chance. We'll have fewer students, for sure, but the programme and whole experience will be better. As I say, different markets. And the customer will have to be the judge.
     
  12. portnoy58

    portnoy58 Well-Known Member

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    Well unfortunately you're coming on here and posing as an expert. Claiming Nottingham is 100% online is not indicative of expertise - it is a cardinal error which brings into issue your credibility as far as I'm concerned. You might not like the Nottingham PGCEi or the way the four day face-to-face event is delivered but saying it is 100% online is quite different from that.

    You talk about market forces which, if you are of that ilk, presumably explain why the Keele PGCEi is no longer being offered. They would hardly shut it down if it was a cash cow, methinks. Maybe it just wasn't very good...

    My statement about Pattana is not anecdotal. It was confirmed in an email by a senior manager. Of course this does not mean that you get a PGCEi and stroll into a job at Pattana. If only.....! But I did ask as a general enquiry as opposed to making an application; the answer was in the affirmative.

    I love your line about what every educationalist knows. Pretty patronising really and once more demonstrates complete ignorance of the Nottingham PGCEi. My final two assignments were based purely on teaching I actually planned and delivered and included recordings and all manner of stuff plus it benefited from a huge amount of reflection and discussion. I really believe my practice benefited immensely and immediately from this course and some of the things that I did as a result of being on this course ... like keep a log, which I still do.

    I wish you luck with the course but I think you will struggle to challenge Nottingham and I don't believe the way to market your course is to take pops at the Nottingham edition or to misrepresent it.
     
  13. Gor Blimey Guvnur!

    Gor Blimey Guvnur! What the duck ! Staff Member

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    Umm, didn't say it was but I could say 'on par' unless you can offer these percieved insights you have to the audience that comes across threads like this when it comes to making a decision and parting with cash ...then well ....Ill leave the conclusion to the decision makers worried about future career prospects.
    Yes, you may have a lot of experience but so do many unqualified teachers living here in Thailand that see promises and courses come ...and some go.

    Time for a beer I think from a 13 year long unqualified teacher in Thailand.
     
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  14. stephenmw

    stephenmw Thread Starter Member

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    I am not going to make any further comment on the Notts PGCEi. As I say, its one offer, the SU is another. What I will stress is that the SU PGCEi is excellent value for money when you consider that a student attends three, weekend events spread over seven months, receives a full teaching practice assessment by an SU tutor, and is taught and supported throughout by SU tutors. SU is not using local teachers but flying out specialist tutors/researchers from the Dept of Educ at the University. The only higher quality experience you could expect would be to return to the UK and do a full PGCE.
     
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  15. GanDoonToonPet

    GanDoonToonPet Well-Known Member

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    Could you provide a link to information on the Staffordshire University website? I couldn't find any details, not even an announcement, and they don't have any 'international partnerships' in Thailand...
     
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